non ww melee assassin build

[tidus2005]

are there any good builds for a melee assassin with out using a chaos and wwing? if so could you please post the skills point allocation. stats ill figure out nothing hard about it, enough str and dex for gear vitality get the rest. and no energy

[Vollstrecker]

Tiger Strike is an absolute must, I think EVERYONE maxes that...

To be perfectly honest, I haven't made an Assassin since before Damage Reduction % and Fury were discovered, so I'm a little lost on those.

Dragon Tail is useless now that you can merely use Enigma, and Cobra Stike would be pretty useless since leech no longer works compently in PvP.

Would this be like an Open dueler, or a Melee vs. Melee?

[tidus2005]

it would most likely be a melee dueler because i have only found a few melee classes that can actaully duel other non melee classes. this is for my friend he wants to make a melee assassin and we are pretty ladder poor right now so we cant afford a chaos.

[zagggon]

Tidus are you guys on west ladder? If so, we should meet up sometime and add each other, you wont be so poor after our encounter :).

[glory_gamer]

no we play on east .... sry dude now i kinda wish we did play west lol

[HandOfHeaven]

Well, let's see now. I posted this awhile back, made some adjustments, so here goes.
Here is a melee assassin build I came up with. I think my stat distribution should be better, but here goes. Oh and the main skills are Dragon Claw and Phoenix Strike.
ITEMS:
Helm: Crown of Ages (I would socket with an UM and IST/Topaz): Delirium
Armor: Chains of Honor; Enigma; Shaftstop
Ammy: Mara’s Kaleidoscope (of course)
Rings: Bul Kathos’ Wedding Band and Raven Frost
Boots: Shadow Dancer
Gloves: Soul Drainers
Belt: Verdungo’s Hearty Cord
Weapon Combo’s
Eth Bartuc’s Cutthroat (upgraded) and Shadow Killer
Jade Talon and Shadow Killer


Skills:
20 Claw Mastery
20 Phoenix Strike
20 Dragon Claw
5 Venom
5 Shadow Master
5 Fists of Fire
5 Claws of Thunder
5 Blades of Ice
1 Psychic Hammer, 1 Cloak of Shadows, 1 Mind Blast, 1 Weapon Block, 1 Cobra Strike, 1 Dragon Tail, 1 Tiger Strike, 1 Dragon Flight, 1 Burst of Speed, 1 Fade, 1 Dragon Talon

You will have used 96 skill points for this, so it is going to be around a lvl84 when completed (if all skill quests are completed). I suggest the rest of the points go into Venom or Shadow Master.
Sort of winging it from here, but whatever.
Stats:

Strength: 180
Dexterity: 165
Vitality: 165
Energy: 80
(This is at lvl 99)

You will be using Phoenix Strike as your main skill, and with all the leach in this build, I don’t believe you will run out of mana that fast. And the Dragon Claw is your right-click attack. Remember to renew Venom and you Shadow Master once in awhile, as the venom adds 200-300 at the skill levels and the master is a good ally. I Advise an Act II Might Merc with Doom, Leviathin, Shako.

Post comments/other builds.

[glory_gamer]

thanks for the info ....

[Vollstrecker]

I'm not too happy with what HoH posted (it doesn't seem to be for PvP), so I'll try my own. This will be ideal gear, affordable gear to follow. This is also assuming a Melee vs. Melee fight:

Stats
STR: 82
DEX: Keep 75% block
VIT: Rest of points here
ENE: Leave at base.

Equipment - All assumed to be perfect or near perfect.
Helm: Andariel's Visage (40%ED/+20Life Jewel)
Armor: Ethereal Arkaine's Valor (Zod)
Weapon: Eth Upgraded 'Tucs (Zod)
Shield: Stormshield (40%ED/+20Life Jewel)
Gloves: Dracul's Grasp
Belt: Verdungo's Hearty Cord
Boots: Shadow Dancer
Ring1: Raven Frost
Ring2: Bul Kathos' Wedding Band
Amulet: Highlord's Wrath

Charms: 1 Annihilus | 10 Martial Arts Charms | 9 3/20/20's.

Skills
Tiger Strike [20]
Dragon Talon [20]
Burst of Speed [1]
Claw Mastery [20]
Venom [20]
Shadow Master [20]
Including the pre-reqs, that's a total of 106 Skill Points, so you'd be complete at 94. The rest of the Skill Points are up to you.

Your attack speed is maxed with Tiger Strike at 7 FPA. You basically just charge up 3 charges of Tiger Strike, and just let rip with Dragon Talon.

Post comments/questions here.

[blckshdwdragon]

sheesh.......................... all i have to say is invest in charge-up = GO REMAKE

i will explain later when i feel like typin. im off to bed ill edit this post and a much much MUCH more viable pker

[tidus2005]

yeah zaggon i play both east and west, and i cant wait to see what the resident pvp expert ,blckshdwdragon has to recommend. but until he does ill just say that i saw one of the coolest builds for this type of assassin in a duel game. i had never even thought about it but kicking assassins are very viable now, because there was a kicking assassin a melee game killing everyone, minus a barb that said he had 28k defense. but from what i saw this assassin used dragon talon, dragon flight, the shadow disiple which lowers defense, and with bursts of speed and it was insanely fast and decent damage. some noteable items that he had were uped gores, and razor edge(unique tomahawk).

[Vollstrecker]

So adding *2000% ED is useless?

Please post your build, since you're anxious to knock mine.

[blckshdwdragon]

So adding *2000% ED is useless?

Please post your build, since you're anxious to knock mine.

with pleasure, first off let me point out flaws with in ur build then mine

Stats
STR: 82
DEX: Keep 75% block
VIT: Rest of points here
ENE: Leave at base.

1st thing - str = KEY factor in the kick damg forumla as fllows and self explanatory:
MinDmg = (str+dex-20)/4)*(100+skill_bonus)/100 + BootMinDam*(100+str*StrBonus/100+skill_bonus)/100

MaxDmg = (str+dex-20)/3)*(100+skill_bonus)/100 + BootMaxDam*(100+str*StrBonus/100+skill_bonus)/100

dex-another issue, where as BASE dex could be used and keep str/vit at higher numbers and thru the viablilty of weapon block(wb) where as dex is not required.
vit- no beef with that.

NOW
Equipment - All assumed to be perfect or near perfect.
Helm: Andariel's Visage (40%ED/+20Life Jewel)
Armor: Ethereal Arkaine's Valor (Zod)
Weapon: Eth Upgraded 'Tucs (Zod)
Shield: Stormshield (40%ED/+20Life Jewel)
Gloves: Dracul's Grasp
Belt: Verdungo's Hearty Cord
Boots: Shadow Dancer
Ring1: Raven Frost
Ring2: Bul Kathos' Wedding Band
Amulet: Highlord's Wrath

who the hell wants to use the pos andy helm... shako still is > it by dr and mass life bonus makes up for the +2X str by FAR, next valor... by first the worst armor ever made for its steep str req with that kind of str isnt worth the vit given even at lvl 99, 08 valor would be well worth using but dont exist anymore, ammy, belt gloves boots, rings are fine

charms are ok, as u seem to think that damg > longevity/verstility as ur build seems to lack resists

SKILLS~!
Tiger Strike [20] - big no no ur a Kicker
Dragon Talon [20] - np here
Burst of Speed [1] - more points could be optional
Claw Mastery [20] - big no no ur a Kicker
Venom [20] - np here
Shadow Master [20] - np here

basically its pointless to charge up, as a kicker all u do is kick got it?, charging up is like a slow suicide for pvp now. yah u go ahead and try to get that extra 2000%ed while someone kills u ^ ^ and teleports etc now my build i post in another post since im running a lil low on space or so i think

[Vollstrecker]

I wasn't posting a pure Kicker guide. The Dragon Talon was mainly aimed for the High Attack Rating bonus, and the Tiger Strike was aimed to enhance the damage of the kick. Like I said, I haven't made an Assassin for a while, so I wasn't fully informed when I made this. :p

The STR was the minimum for all the +STR gear that is included with the Equipment. With all the bonuses, the STR would be fairly respectable to enhance the Kick damage. I chose Eth Valor mainly for the Defense it would provide, but then, I forgot about Chains of Honor.

As far as skills go, the 1 point in BoS was enough to get the maximum 7FPA Tiger Strike, so I saw no real need in wasting further points.

The charms are more for damage yes, but the 3/20/20's were more for the Attack Rating bonus and life. I suppose Steel Small Charms of Vita would work also.

To be honest, I don't think I turned out a bad build, it just may not be 100% in-line with the times. I never really played Assassins.

You'd need a significant amount of IAS if you're aiming for a 8FPA or 7FPA Dragon Tail.

[blckshdwdragon]

my build would follow something like this depeneding if u wanna go c/c or c|other/s:
stats:
str: recomended enuff for gear, and if ur a good pvper more here = more damg but less life
dex: base/enough to wear ur weapon/claw but IF u are doing weapon/shield then u will need to poor more stats here for 75% block thus less life and some damg returns as its factored in kick damg
vit: everything else here


skills:
20 venom
20 dtalon
1-20 Shadow master - how good do u want ur tank, light, medium, or heavy ^ ^
1+ burst of speed
1+ fade (recomended slvl 15ish)
1 WoF
1 Dragon flight
1 Mind blast
1 blade fury - optional if u want better chances vs a melee tank class char
1 Blade shield - optional
slvl26- weapon block (will have 60% to block) optional skill

a must max:
Venom is a TRUE killer and contraversal skill and debated amoung most asn's.
Dtalon, obvious to the build it is ur main attack. Shadow master the best minon u could have resists + high damg if they hit and great decoy only downside is its casting delay is tied to dflight

the minimal skills that aid u the most(best bang for the skill point so to speak :P):
burst/fade resists or speed for free type spell. Dflight for getting to ur opponents and kicking them to death. Mind blast in conjuntion with WoF, dont like squirming prey?? heres ur solution. barbs ww hurt toooo much?? blade fury comes in handy(explantion below)

optionals: blade shield carries soome venom damg but a fraction of it but still helps greatly as venom is only .4 secs long, enuff to do some damg b4 u do damg, same with blade fury, as i mentioned that weapon block is optional/ NECESSARY for a hybrid type between c/c or weapon/s type

equipment as follows
helm - shako, Guillaume's face
ammy - maras, highlords, angelic wings if u want more ar and necessary vs high def.... DUH (HL depending it u are w/s or c/c)
armor - Bramble, 160/60 armor with life(affects kick damg), 3 poisen facet nat armor(VERY good for c/c),
belt- verdungos recomended 15%dr
rings, 1 r frost min, nice rare ring stats and resists are very nice, bk ring, ang ring for ar
boots- shadow dancer preferably +2 skills
gloves- ik gloves, crafted bllod gloves with 10% cb, bloodfists
weapon- bartucs (GREAT claw for a kicker), j talon,
shield- storm shield with a hel rune like affect wit str/dex (rare jewel etc)

charms i would use would be Shadow disciples with life 10 of them if u can, but 10 plain ones are just as good to a degree, also anni + sc of vitas, if ur rich get some with resists or ar if u feel u want more, theoritically 6kish ar hits pretty dam good on 10kish def etc(dont wanna look it up atm, only remember first bracket atm)

yah so this is actually about 20x more viable than trying to claw someone and MUCH less expensive to complete and at an early lvl mid 80ish or so, mainly depends what u want, so yah w/e

[blckshdwdragon]

I wasn't posting a pure Kicker guide. The Dragon Talon was mainly aimed for the High Attack Rating bonus, and the Tiger Strike was aimed to enhance the damage of the kick. Like I said, I haven't made an Assassin for a while, so I wasn't fully informed when I made this. :p

The STR was the minimum for all the +STR gear that is included with the Equipment. With all the bonuses, the STR would be fairly respectable to enhance the Kick damage. I chose Eth Valor mainly for the Defense it would provide, but then, I forgot about Chains of Honor.

As far as skills go, the 1 point in BoS was enough to get the maximum 7FPA Tiger Strike, so I saw no real need in wasting further points.

The charms are more for damage yes, but the 3/20/20's were more for the Attack Rating bonus and life. I suppose Steel Small Charms of Vita would work also.

To be honest, I don't think I turned out a bad build, it just may not be 100% in-line with the times. I never really played Assassins.

You'd need a significant amount of IAS if you're aiming for a 8FPA or 7FPA Dragon Tail.

i guess i was typing too slow and doing some clan stuff so yah read my first post as to y charging up is a very very very bad idea and extremely difficult to pull off in a pub game or priv league(yah rite.... LMAO)

btw: ive been playing asns for about 2 1/2 yrs or so and pallies since classic

[tidus2005]

umm i dont think that venom works with dragon talon because i made one on single player and it didnt add to my damage. i was thinking about using a shadow warrior because i figured that with 2 people kicking insanely fast the the enemy would be block locked, but i might go with shadow master. also i dont see the use of blade fury, i see where blade shield might be useful since i will but up close anyway. i am gonna use cloak of shadows because at lvl 20 it lowers enemy defense by 72 percent and supposedly will make my defense better by 67 percent. and you say not to max dragon flight why??? i think that the ar and damage of my initail hit should but up there, with lvl 20 dragon flight it ups my ar by 480 percent and my damage by 575 percent. and for boots i think that uped gores would work better because of the better mods on them i would take deadly strike open wounds and crushing blow over +2 to skills any day. i can see were wake of fire and mind blast would be helpful tho. and for my weapon a bartuc could be helpful for the bonus to ar, str, and dex so ill try between it and razors edge because i like the stats on razors edge they are all around nice
-33% Target Defense
50% Deadly Strike
50% Chance of Open Wounds
so just post back to correct me or maybe offer an explaination to the blade fury thing of why/when i would ever need to use it. after i get this character made ill try out the differen weapons.

[blckshdwdragon]

mind u BF is a prereq of blade shield, BF is used as a defensive skill, sometimes u CANT tank things thus u must weaken them first to stand a chance to kill them, 1 point into DF is all u really need, with casters and melee chars have max black the reality is most of ur dflights WILL NOT hit but is only used to get to the guy, and u have 19 pts to spend elsewhere. for the issue of ur +2 skills vs deadly strike, lets say marars givs u 30 to all and u have 45 resist to fire, and a good fb sorc comes along and manages to shoot u, u would probly only be able to trake 1-3 at most assuming ur life is around 2k while maras would increase wb ur attack damg etc, cb is only as affective if their BASE life is high, the lower the less effective, shadow warrior is nice for its def bonus, but still doesnt come close to a sm its basically more life, resists and damg just for defence

[tidus2005]

ok i wasnt really looking to the gores for the cb and deadly strike i was going for the open wounds because with gores and razors edge ill have 60% OW which is pretty good for as fast as i am hitting, and what about bursts of speed why only one it in? i can see what you are talking about dragon flight only needing one becuase of the delay and the chance to block. also have you tried out venom becuase at lvl 20 it is not really much psn damage at all, only 425-445 which can easily be negated to pretty much nothing after the pvp penalty and decent resist, and i still am not sure that it works with dragon talon at least not visably unless i missed something. also this is for east ladder so it will be much cheaper to get a pair of gores and a lem and ko to up them then to get a pair of shadow dancers, and grand charms are out of the question too for a little while, and since i now wont have so many points into dragon flight i could go for fade now.

[blckshdwdragon]

ok i wasnt really looking to the gores for the cb and deadly strike i was going for the open wounds because with gores and razors edge ill have 60% OW which is pretty good for as fast as i am hitting, and what about bursts of speed why only one it in? i can see what you are talking about dragon flight only needing one becuase of the delay and the chance to block. also have you tried out venom becuase at lvl 20 it is not really much psn damage at all, only 425-445 which can easily be negated to pretty much nothing after the pvp penalty and decent resist, and i still am not sure that it works with dragon talon at least not visably unless i missed something. also this is for east ladder so it will be much cheaper to get a pair of gores and a lem and ko to up them then to get a pair of shadow dancers, and grand charms are out of the question too for a little while, and since i now wont have so many points into dragon flight i could go for fade now.

in dtalon the venom damg is not shown in the char stats screen, but IT IS APPLIED, as for deadly strike im not enitrely sure about it working, up'ed gores are good alternatives to shadow dancers, shadow dancers are more along the lines for pub dueling as gores for the cb vs melee char where vit is an abundance thus making it more effective than simple + skills, but it MAINLY depends on ur gear setup, as for a simple way to boost venom would be tang gloves, if u feel the poisen is too weak try trang gloves if u dont like the damg go lvl up and get a pair of draculs, OW is more over the lines of supplementary damg(OW isnt everything) where as razor's edge is ezly beaten by bartucs, everything on bartucs adds to dtalon and venom and more domg physical and poisen.

OT btw: tidus since when was i deemed zelarons pvp expert?? if i am i want the title to show, if not ill go back to a reading state etc
EDIT: voll. i await ur input :P

[Vollstrecker]

voll. i await ur input :P

It sounds like it would work, but I noticed a lack of Deadly Strike with your first gear selection. Do you think swapping out your Mara's for a Highlords + dropping a "Lo" in your 'Tucs would detract in any way?

[tidus2005]

ok well i consider you zelarons pvp expert and that counts for a lot ;);) i think that you would make a good mod for the pvp forum since apoq left. and if i use claw block i will go for the tucs because on the summit I found a nice little formula for kick damage but it doesnt really mean a whole lot to me cuz i dont feel like thinking about it right now, but from what i can see right from the start is that dex and str are input into which is nice because bartucs give both not to mention that with claw blocking i could block hammers bone spirits and i have even heard that it blocks fohs too.
Kick Damage
MinDamage=(str+dex-20)/4)*(100+skill_bonus)/100 + BootMinDam*(100+str*StrBonus/100+skill_bonus)/100
MaxDamage=(str+dex-20)/3)*(100+skill_bonus)/100 + BootMaxDam*(100+str*StrBonus/100+skill_bonus)/100

also i am still waiting for an answer about why so little in burst of speed, is it because it requires little ias to reach the max kick rate?

[blckshdwdragon]

It sounds like it would work, but I noticed a lack of Deadly Strike with your first gear selection. Do you think swapping out your Mara's for a Highlords + dropping a "Lo" in your 'Tucs would detract in any way?

sounds like it would?? lol... go build ur charge up asn and build mine and see the results for ur self lolololololol....... deadly strike as far as i kno has NOT been confirmed to work but i have to wait on diabloii.net b4 choosing Lo to be pur into tucs other wise a + 15-30max damg /ias jewel would help boost physical damg, if DS does infact work then i see no obejection to use ds but if u are think of using razors edge, then no i wouldnt care for that kind damg vs verstility where as tucs happen to have.

[blckshdwdragon]

ok well i consider you zelarons pvp expert and that counts for a lot ;);) i think that you would make a good mod for the pvp forum since apoq left. and if i use claw block i will go for the tucs because on the summit I found a nice little formula for kick damage but it doesnt really mean a whole lot to me cuz i dont feel like thinking about it right now, but from what i can see right from the start is that dex and str are input into which is nice because bartucs give both not to mention that with claw blocking i could block hammers bone spirits and i have even heard that it blocks fohs too.
Kick Damage
MinDamage=(str+dex-20)/4)*(100+skill_bonus)/100 + BootMinDam*(100+str*StrBonus/100+skill_bonus)/100
MaxDamage=(str+dex-20)/3)*(100+skill_bonus)/100 + BootMaxDam*(100+str*StrBonus/100+skill_bonus)/100

also i am still waiting for an answer about why so little in burst of speed, is it because it requires little ias to reach the max kick rate?

i had those forumlas in my "destroying charge up discussion post"" ^^ with all the + skills and tucs being -30 base wsm max fpa dtalon is aquired (as well as J talon)

edit: btw where is Kuja?? havent seen him for a while

[tidus2005]

so is it true that claws can block foh, bone spirits, and hammers?

[blckshdwdragon]

yes, it blocks just about everything except for firewall, the actual orb from frozen orb but the shards are blockable etc, so wb block: bone spirt, hammers, foh, forb shards, blizzard, fball, meteor explosion etc u get the idea right?

[Vollstrecker]

edit: btw where is Kuja?? havent seen him for a while

Kuja quit.

I wasn't saying my charge-up Assassin build was better than your kicker...

I was just saying that Deadly Strike might be an improvement on it, as I believe it does still work.
There wouldn't really be any reason to use Razor's Edge, as Highlords at a decent level + Lo would give you your 50% DS cap.

I may be the D2 Mod, and I may know a bit about the game, but I will NEVER say I know everything. For instance, I wasn't aware Weapon Block would block those skills.

Besides, a Mod is mostly someone there to keep the peace, make sure the rules are obeyed, and to know a bit about the game. I just try to be helpful as well. If someone turns up something better, I have no problems with that, and will even admit someone turned out a better build. :p

[HandOfHeaven]

With that you could PWN a bone necro.

[blckshdwdragon]

voll: ds has no cap as the formula for chance to do 2x damg is -

=CS + (DS/100)*(100-CS)
lets say u got 200 DS as an exm

0+(2*-200) thus -200 now thats a bad thing thus no cap but only screwing it up, if u got cs some minor DS is fine but u will get diminishing returns aprox 1/3 less of the amount ds u got on
however if u have 100ds and 0 cs then by joe u always have double damg like the good ole 09 days :P

hoh: u defintely can, as any class can, it is all a matter of ur approach

[Alucard001]

This is asfar as I know my idea of a melee sassy, taking into consideration what's available skillwise without being called a "trapper/kicker"

Haven't posted many of these so basically this is what I do:


Stat points -
Strength - Enough str for gear, about 150 give or take what you plan on using
Dex - Enough for block/however much AR you think you'll need(mine is 210 with 2 ravens 75 block with stormshield)
Vit - as much as possible, expecially when dancing around with people who teleport like a monk on hot rocks
Energy - ... think about this one guy ...

Skills -
I use mb occasionally if I feel like aggrivating people, 1 point
dragon flight to follow mb(casters, expecially fb sorc) max
Dragon claw - varies with what you want to use, I currently have 5 in it for casters for the damage, but still use a tucs/SS on swap for barbs
Claw mastery, about 5, more if you really think you'll need it
Burst of speed 5, we all like zooming around and attacking fast, more if you can(See gear)
Fade 5, your resist isn't going to be super, and dragon flight beside sorc's doesn't always go hot, use this vs poison necros/other casters
Venom max - Yes venom maxed, the added poison is quite nice in hell expecially if you're lucky and find a poison necro running around, aswell you'll need it for your bow(see gear)
Shadow master max - we all like a friend, high resist +attack and can tank for you even do some damage.
Weapon block - depends on how you swing, I put 5 in it for when I claw/claw vs casters, but you may want a shield for barbs
Traps - never

Gear -
Helm - Gaze, Ias jewel if you can
Armor - I'm using perf levi atm, good +str bonus high def and dr ofcourse, assasins aren't tanks, the DR will help
Belt - Perf verdungo's
Rings - ravens, +AR(you need as much as possible) cold damage and +dex for blocking, Raven for cold sorc dwarf for fire sorc wisp for lightning sorc/trappers, basic stuff
Ammy - cats eye if you want to stray and use a bow(not melee but it works =o ) maras aswell, if you can't sacrifice the speed you lose from using fade this is a very good idea, and the +2 skills and reisst is golden
Gloves - anything with ias, you don't want them to hit be the person getting in the shots, I'm using Laying of hands so I don't have any big recommendations here
Boots - shadow dancer without a question, +2 shadow faster hit recov +dex and faster r/w, the works; aswell it will increase dragon flight damage, not pure melee... but when you're chasing after a zon trying to run against a hail of arrows... well...
Weapons - I'm currently using shaeled bartucs with shaeled jade(+45 res), yes I know people with 40/15 jewels are cursing me, but I'm not rich, and do not own cta for switch. If you don't like the dragon claw you can use SS/tucs on the swap for the +ar more dr and block, good vs zons, but they should die 1 dragon flight anyway =o, aswell, I find if you use widowmaker with venom you can tear a necro apart in so little time, the guided arrow and ignore target deff with the poison damage and burst of speed all come together very nicely.
charms - I'm using 3 rows of 5% r/w charms and 5% hit recov charms, quick as a rabbit strong as an ox.. or something +shadow gc's are nice if you can afford them

This is just a rough outline however much you may want to call it non melee, but not everyone can afford to whirlwind around with cta and enigma laying 5k traps ^_^


-Alucard; lame quote about love and the many despairs about life here

[blckshdwdragon]

since ur not rich would u like an improvement upon ur build but taylored to ur wealth?

[tidus2005]

well i have completed my kicker assassin and i do very well with my upgraded gores. i have some trouble against lightning assassins due to low resist which i am currently working on. i use dual tucs for nice blocking of non melee attacks and switch to a tuc and whistans shield for strictly melee duels. about the only melee char that i have trouble with is a smiter or a ww sin/barb. i think the barb is tough because i cant hit them that often due to having only about 10 ar. but overall if i stun lock anyone minus wind druids with wake of fire then i win easily.