What constitutes an RPG?
 

Okay, I'm setting the record straight once and for all. I've heard far too many people using the term "RPG elements" to describe games that have no resemblance to an RPG, whatsoever! The Legend of Zelda series is not an RPG series! It's a fucking adventure series!! Devil May Cry does not have "RPG-like" elements to it!! It's a fucking action game!!

These are the three rules that determine an RPG. No RPG must have all of these rules, but an RPG must have at least one of these things.

1) Combat is turn-based, allowing for greater depth of strategy and focusing on tactical maneuvers moreso than quick-response or hand-eye coordination.

2) The combat is handled in a multi-character party configuration. The management of a party of individuals, their equipment, stats and abilities is a focus of the game.

3) Character-building is based on experience points or some similar derivative (like FF10's skill grid). Character levels are the standard method of improvement, but other methods do exist.

Those are the three cardinal rules of an RPG. Without at least one of those rules, the game is not a fucking RPG.

Devil May Cry does not have "RPG-like" elements just because Dante can purchase new abilities with Red Orbs. Devil May Cry is an action game. The focus of the game is on, you guessed it, action. Not strategy, stat-building, party-management or story.

The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time is not a goddamned RPG. It is an adventure game. It focuses on exploration and puzzle-solving, not strategy, stat-building, party-management or story.

STOP THROWING AROUND THE TERM "RPG" JUST TO DESCRIBE SOME GAME YOU LIKE. YES, WE UNDERSTAND THAT YOU'RE A FAN OF FINAL FANTASY 7, BUT THAT DOES NOT MEAN THAT EVERY OTHER GAME YOU LIKE IS A GODDAMNED RPG. STOP IT. NOW.

Zelaron.com is a RPG game!

Explain that one.

Characters earn experiences (postcount) and hopefully have some sort of improvements by doing so.

Turn based...battles. You post, I post, he posts, she posts.

Party configuration - bunch of idiots (I won't mention who...) started flooding the flame forum (or any forum) for the pure purpose of pissing the mods off.

Well, that's a sketchy comparison at best. Post count doesn't equal experience or increased intelligence. Look at Randuin.

The turn-based argument actually works.

And the party-configuration would only really apply if one member was managing several different logins at once.

But, I did say that an RPG only requires one of those three rules, so I suppose (if Zelaron was a game) that it would be a fringe-RPG. Just barely, but it would still count.

Some characters might have a cap in their abilities...

But on topic of things, it also annoys me when people say, "And the game has RPG elements in it too, you will like it if you like RPG!" while the game has nothing to do with a RPG game, at all.

And "Pimpiroth's" comment about Devil May Cry is primarily the reason I started this thread. It just drives me fucking bonkers to see people toss that term around so willingly.

This is probably the most insulting example of that kind of statement that I've ever seen:

http://www.legacynexus.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2522

That's the stupidest fucking thing I've ever heard!

Only Zelda: OoT is considered real RPGs.

I don't know how I should react to that.

And I didn't know that RPGs are Roll Playing Games... so what exactly do they play, egg roll or spring roll?

Pecan Roll, I think.

Than again, he might be confusing his games altogether. He might be actually thinking roll playing games, and confusing the title "Ocarina of Time" with "Super Monkey Ball".

Hahaha!

So I see he still didn't take it at the end by saying "I don't care anymore."

But a LOT of people seem to think that Zelda series is an Action RPG...

I also beleive in items being randomly found, not set... like in Zelda which everything is where it is.

I don't know what's so hard to understand about the term "adventure game". The Zelda games are adventure games, yet there are an overwhelmingly large number of people who insist that the word "adventure" is nowhere to be found In Zelda's genre title.

Action games revolve around action. Combat of some form is the focus. Action games are fast-paced and they test your reflexes and eye-hand coordination.

RPGs the polar opposite. They focus on details. They focus on stats. RPGs focus on character/party management, equipment management, experience gaining, level building, strategy and plot.

Adventure games focus on exploration and puzzle solving. Yes, many adventure games allow for your character to become stronger over time and have interesting plots. Yes, many adventure games have action elements in them. But the core of the game's design revolves around exploration and puzzle-solving. The Zelda games revolve around exploration and puzzle solving. Even the boss battles are puzzles! The Zelda games have always been adventure games, and people need to realize it. Now. My patience wears thin.

And yeah, BobtheDead just folded in the end. That's part of the reason why I dislike that forum so much. Try to argue with anyone and they just collapse like a house of cards.

Anyone else see a connection?

My brother never said DevilMayCry was an RPG. He said it had RPG elements.

They dont have to have all of those to be a RPG right? Is D2 an RPG? It isnt turn based like D&D

D2 uses elements from D&D but I don't consider it to be an RPG. It's too shitty.

I never played D2 so I don't even know what kind of RPG elements it even would have.

Stat building

but, its suppose to be an action game

Stat building is a big thing in RPG's but that doesn't automatically make it an RPG though.

Technically if you play the role of a character in any game, it is considered a role playing game.

Pwnt.

Here is something to make it easier. Look at what the game is officially rated. Its right on the box or package or case it comes in. That makes sence doesn't it. That determines weather u can call a game an RPG, or Action, or Adventure or Action Adventure and so forth.

I lable you gay, now are you gay? lol j/k

And I now label u a piece of shit. Cause my old computer is a Acer pc and its a piece of shit.

read the thread how every got their names... you will see my name isnt the computer acer :)

Umm, battles don't have to be turn based, look at Secret of Mana.

If the game has any one of the three, he said.

Secret of Mana has party and character improvement through level (if I remember correctly) :p

I think this is flat out the answer... a RPG can be action, adv, or w/e... but you must play the role of something. This pretty much includes the upgrading of characters... but xp/levels maybe isn't the only way.

I think Acer's got the point. An RPG is a game where you play the main character how you wish (instead of an adventure game where you just solve problems so that the almost completely linear plot can continue). I mean, a lot of people consider Diablo an RPG, when I consider it an action game.

I must state, however, that my favourite games are strategy RPGs like FF:Tactics.

Diablo is not an RPG. The character you play is not a specific character to a specific storyline, but yet a character which you specify in a static story line.

Then, would people consider a Sim game as a RPG? If they are just using the reason of "playing the role of something?"

I think by role, they mean role of a character/person. I don't know much about SIMs but if you play the role of one person the maybe

Okay, no. Just simply "playing the role" of a character does not make it an RPG. By that standard, every Sim game on the market is an RPG. In SimCity you play as the mayor of your budding new city and can develop said city in any way you wish. SimCity is not a friggin' RPG.

The three rules I listed are the three core traits that any traditional RPG uses. Like I said, and RPG only has to have one of the three rules.

I don't agree with that in the slightest. How is playing the role of a predetermined character like Cloud from FF7 any different than playing the role of a predetermined character like Link? There's no difference. To define an RPG, you must look at the gameplay, and the three gameplay rules I listed are the foundation of any traditional RPG. Adventure games focus on exploration and puzzle solving, RPGs focus on stat-building, combat strategy and party management.

Since when do you make the rules on what makes a game what?

Look at the name. Role Playing Game. That means a game in which you play the role of a character.

role-playing game
n.
A game in which players assume the roles of characters and act out fantastical adventures, the outcomes of which are partially determined by chance, as by the roll of dice.

Yes, so making Zelda not a RPG as said, cuz everything in the game is static.

I dont know much about FF, but it has random stuff in there? Which makes it a RPG?

That would mean a game with a linear plot cannot be a RPG, which isn't true at all.

read the back of the game case. it tells u.

Monsters don't drop the same items every time, so there is some randomness.

Yeah I didn't think of that when I wrote it.

...No. Static or not, it doesn't matter. A RPG can be very linear without much randomness.

It is the focus of the game. An adventure game put emphasis on area such as puzzle solving and adventuring. For example, the Silent Hill series. But there is indeed a lot of actions in many adventure games, so personally I don't mind people calling a Adventure game as an Action-Adventure... But Adventure-RPG? No. Not unless it does have RPG elements in it. (Upgrading or finding weapons isn't a RPG element, by the way.)

Just in what games are you NOT playing a role of something? (Pong, Minesweeper, Tetris... you don't have to answer this question.) Well, even in the Gran Turismo series, you are playing a role of someone. Or the Championship Manager series, where you are playing the role of a Soccer Manager. In fighting games, you are controlling the characters you've selected, and play his role during the fight.

Just because we get to play a role of something in a game does not make it a RPG game.

First of all, King, that definition you used is in reference to paper and pencil RPGs, in which a player actually plays the role of an original character. We're talking about console RPGs, and in a console RPG, that definition does not apply. It does not apply, because 95% of console RPGs use predetermined characters.

All of the Final Fantasy games are 90% static. You don't create your own character, they have their own pre-written lines, and the actual interactive story elements (i.e. "Do I take Aeris on a date or Tifa?") are few and far between. Therefore, your Webster's definition of a Role Playing game does not work in this situation.

A video game RPG always has one of the three elements I have listed. I did not make these rules up, I'm simply clarifying them. It's the same thing as if I was saying "All platform games contain some form of platforming action and usually some platform-based puzzles." I'm simply stating a fact.


By your definition, if Final Fantasy is an RPG (meaning that some of the randomness comes from the items an enemy drops) then Zelda and Metal Gear Solid are RPGs as well. You play the role of Link, and there's no definite answer as to whether a recently killed Moblin will drop rupees, arrows, bombs, magic jars or some other weird artifact like a Joy Pendant. The same goes for MGS. You play the role of Solid Snake, and if you kill an enemy, you can pick them up and shake extra items out of their clothing. It could be SOCOM ammo, FA-MAS ammo, Rations or any number of other items. Zelda and Metal Gear Solid are not RPGs though, therefore, this discredits your Webster's definition even further.

I'm not making this shit up, I'm simply stating a fact. Console RPGs focus on level building, party management and combat strategy. Platformers focus on platforming action and action-based puzzles. Adventure games focus on exploration and puzzles. First Person Shooters focus on shooting from a first-person perspective, utilizing speed and accuracy for stealth and headshots. That's simply the way it is. I'm not making it up, it's plain fact.