Zelaron Gaming Forum - What would you change?

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uncapped

2003-07-28 08:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raziel

If I truly believed that there was no God, then there would be no purpose behind living at all. If nothing created us then there is no such thing as right or wrong, there is no such thing as love or hate. If there is no human soul, then emotions are nothing more than a series of random, unreasonable neural transmissions with no real weight or relevance attached to their existance. If we weren't created by something, then we are an accident. If we are an accident, then there's no reason why I shouldn't stop typing right this second and delete the most annoying accidents I've encountered recently.

Example: I'm at work, and a man in one of our rooms just called down to the front desk and asked for a wake up call. When I answered the phone, he referred to me as "ma'am." Now, if there is no God, then there is no real meaning to the ideas of "wrong" or "right". If God doesn't exist, then those polar extremes are fabrications of the human collective unconscious, and they have no real meaning. If we're an accident, then so is everything we've created. That includes the ideas of wrong and right.

So, what's stopping me from walking up to that man's room and killing him right this second? Because I know it's wrong. It may not be the Christian God that is looking down upon us, but something created us. If not, then what is the point of clinging to life in any way, shape or form?

*claps*

Medieval Bob

2003-07-28 08:16 PM

Damn.. pwn Raziel.

Seriously tho...

Pwn.

slaynish

2003-07-28 08:17 PM

Clap, Clap, Clap, i really think you have a point raziel...

Titusfied

2003-07-28 09:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raziel

So, does that mean that if we create something, whether it be a child, or merely a piece of art, that we are their God? Just because something created us, doesn't mean that is the only reason we love and hate, or have feelings about what is right and wrong. It means that we are here for a reason, for someone had a vision of something great, or for all we know, a vision for destruction, violence, and something that is above and beyond anything we have even thought of yet.

While I agree that a God exists, and also that if we were created by an accident, then there is no real base for our existence, I don't necessarily feel that because there is a God, that is the only reason our mental processes and behavior act the ways they do. I like to feel as though I matter in the world, whether or not my parents meant to have me. I like to feel as though I'm in control of how I shape my life, and how my future will turn out. I guess I'm trying to say that even if there isn't a higher being that made all this possible, and we actually are an accident, that what happens on Earth still matters.

MarkiX

2003-07-28 10:33 PM

I am a christion myself a lil but i have a lot of doubts.

Anyways, Random thought i would focus more on what benefits me rather than thinking about a god that may or may not exist.

Religion is gay! We should learn to do whats best for ourselves rather than rely on scripture to tell us how to live.

I grow up in a religious household. I hate it God this God that. I wish think that one should do what benefits him morally.
http://www.geocities.com/markix2003/firesig.jpg

Raziel

2003-07-28 11:03 PM

You're not understanding what I'm saying, Titus. Unless there is such a thing as the human soul, then emotion has no weight, no substance, no purpose. If the human soul is a fable, then emotion boils down to nothing more than unexplainable electrochemical responses. The fact is, in order for a human being to be more than plain matter, in order for our race to consist of more than just flesh, there needs to be a soul. The human soul can't exist unless it was placed there by a "creator."

There is a reason why it's okay for a wolf to kill a deer, or a shark to kill a seal. It's because they're animals. It's because of the fact that they have no soul that it's okay for them to kill and eat one another. What sets us apart from animals is our souls. If our sould don't actually exist, then we're nothing more than highly advanced animals. If we're just nothing more than really intelligent monkeys, then why shouldn't I be allowed to kill you and devour your body?

MarkiX

2003-07-28 11:23 PM

Feeling are chemical reactions that happen in your brain. Chemicals like saritonin make u feel hungry or tired. What about endorphins the make u happy. There may be a human soul. But no one knows for sure cus no one has proven it.
http://www.geocities.com/markix2003/firesig.jpg

Titusfied

2003-07-28 11:30 PM

Well, I just still don't buy into the fact that if God didn't create us, then we don't have a soul, but rather highly advanced electrochemical reactions that can't be explained. Regardless of us being an accident or not, I still think that we have souls. Our lives can't just be highly interactive spontaneous links between each person. I truely believe that everyone is important, everyone has a soul, and everyone was "created" for a reason, whether it be by a God, or even by a mistake.

MarkiX

2003-07-28 11:39 PM

WEll i do believe in God......... I think. And i know we are not an accident but its hard to believe that there is a soul in my opinion. If we did have a soul where is it? And why is it that when one takes a stimulant it affects how we feel if it only stimulates the brain not the soul. People do say the soul is what makes our emotions.
http://www.geocities.com/markix2003/firesig.jpg

Titusfied

2003-07-28 11:50 PM

Just because certain parts of the brain cause particular emotions, behaviors, stimulus, etc. doesn't mean that the person in general doesn't have a soul. A soul is simply something that you need to believe in, it isn't something that can necessarily be proven. It's like God I guess. As much as you can show these "facts" and undeniable "proof", fact of the matter is, all of that stuff was passed down over thousands of years, so who really knows what did and didn't happen?

Its all about the faith man, either you got it, or you don't. :)

0nyx	2003-07-29 12:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raziel

dissected during waking hours.

If there is no god then what? we would all stop having emotions and feelings? and we would have no purpose? thats crap! we exist, we are here and we do nothing more special than any creature on this earth. We survive, we propergate, we die. That is it.

There is no God, religion is only surpression for the mass's. That is what is stopping you from murder. We have lived in social structures for so many years, under the belief of the after life and judgement day, that we as a breed have developed morals. we have evolved them and developed them into our comon laws by which we live today. A person is smart but people are dumb, and dumb people need to controlled with rules.

Quote:

Originally Posted by raziel

If I truly believed that there was no God, then there would be no purpose behind living at all.

Yeah thats right belief gives people a reason to go on. But if tomorrow you found out there was no God, then you would feel an absence and have many questions, but your life would not stop, you would still have to go about erning your living and looking after your family, We survive, we propergate, we die. That is it.

Every thing we are today is a natural evolution, a random event of molecules coming together and forming life, and after its short spark of existance it dies out and returns it's self back to just molecules again.

I don't know if i'm making my point any better now, it's probly too long to bother reading now lol.

Medieval Bob

2003-07-29 08:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Titusfied

Well, I just still don't buy into the fact that if God didn't create us, then we don't have a soul

I don't believe it is possible for beings to evolve a soul. This is just speculation, but I think a soul must be God-given.

Acer	2003-07-29 08:35 AM

I beleive our soul is just a focus of energy and once we die it joins the rest of the world and is reborn into many other things. Like plants -> soil kinda deal.

MarkiX

2003-07-29 09:48 AM

I dont think it should matter. We should live our lives to the way we want to live them and dontlet any non proven beliefs stand in our way. I live w/ a religious father so i cant live my life the way that most ppl can. If i was as eligious as him i would not have most of my friends or do most things i do. God or any religious fig. should not limit us to things we want to do as long as its moral. in the eyes of your own and maybe sometimes your peers.

Acer	2003-07-29 11:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarkiX

Aslong as your morals are for the good of everyone. Live clean and don't hurt others, then w/e religion is right, I dont think you will be punished.

0nyx	2003-07-29 11:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Medieval Bob

I don't believe it is possible for beings to evolve a soul. This is just speculation, but I think a soul must be God-given.

Just to be objective

How do you even know we have a soul?

Titusfied

2003-07-29 12:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Titusfied

A soul is simply something that you need to believe in, it isn't something that can necessarily be proven. It's like God I guess. As much as you can show these "facts" and undeniable "proof", fact of the matter is, all of that stuff was passed down over thousands of years, so who really knows what did and didn't happen?

Its all about the faith man, either you got it, or you don't. :)

Shining Knights

2003-07-29 01:23 PM

It matters not whether you win or lose; what matters is whether I win or lose.

Acer	2003-07-29 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shinto Katana

What is the meaning of life you ask? Nothing, face it, we die. We just die. Emotions? Everyone dies, it's nothing new. Why are we so scared to die? Because we don't want to face blankness.

But, who knows. What if we did go to heaven? Yea? So what. We still miss the ones we love on the earth. I can't even go on, and explain things, because the emotions of dieing in 40-70 years is getting too me. :(

Yes, but thinking like that will encourage suicide... if you think there is blankness after death, but it can also drive you to live life to its fulless.

Raziel

2003-07-29 04:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 0nyx

We survive, we propergate, we die. That is it.

If there is no God, then yes you're right, that's all we do.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Titus

Well, I just still don't buy into the fact that if God didn't create us, then we don't have a soul, but rather highly advanced electrochemical reactions that can't be explained.

The human soul is not something that can just be "developed", Titus. If that's the way it works, then why haven't ancient reptillian species developed them? Why are we the only creatures on the planet that have structured societies and laws? Why are we the only creatures that make noticeable advances in the span of a few years? There are only two possibilites: either we have souls, or our species is an evolutionary monstrosity. If we have souls, then something had to put them there. If something didn't put them there, then why are we the only race in town that has them?

In order to believe in the human soul, one must beleive that supernatural elements are a part of our existence. If one believes that supernatural elements do exist in this world, then one must allow for the possibility that God exists. Like I said, when I use the term "God" I do not necessarily refer to the Christian God. Just a "creator" of supernatural origin.

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