Remove negative rep? Remove all rep?

[WetWired]

Without negative rep, there can be no "negative rep retribution," nor can there be "negative rep out of spite." I think this will lead to a more meaningful indicator.

http://zelaron.com/forum/mychat.php?do=log&date=20080311&pp=200&page=2

[Thanatos]

I disagree.

I mean, is there some huge underlying crisis that is going on right now that we, as members, aren't aware of? What made you think this? Because Grav got upset that he got neg. repped twice? He was being an asshole in that specific post so I called him out on it.

Who is abusing the system so bad that we need to re-vamp things?

[D3V]

It's fine. Just because some emo non-conformist douchebags are getting negative rep they want it changed because their e-peen hurts. I say leave it how it is, it's fun, it's something new, if you guys just want to stay in the past and never get anything new on here then so be it, there will never, ever be any new members or ever anything interesting on these boards.

[D3V]

Who is abusing the system so bad that we need to re-vamp things?

Here's a simple fucking soluion, just make rep viewable for each member and who repped them. Problem solved.

[Lenny]

If someone is being an arse, then I want to be able to negative rep them for being an arse.

Maybe if there were more meaning to it (a shop, say), and there was a real problem with people getting negative repped out of spite, then yeah, make some changes, but getting rid of negative rep just because one or two people are being pissy over someone getting three bars... I mean, come on! WTF is that all about? Oh noes, three bars, he must be a cheater! Grow up.

So no, leave it as it is in terms of negative rep.

However, would it be worth making comments compulsory, and maybe even moderated (in all honesty, it wouldn't be much of a workload for us), just to keep the babies happy that no-one is playing the system?

[Asamin]

I agree. If one person is not saying good things or just being annoying i think that we should be able to mark them as such. But, if someone doesn't care about the repping, then they should be able to make it not see-able by them.

[Thanatos]

+Rep for that post, Lenny.

If certain people don't care about the reputation system and think it's immature and meaningless, then don't pay attention to it. You aren't being forced to. Let the people that do use it to continue doing so.

[D3V]

Look guys.

This is a simple fix.







Make the Reputation able to be viewed by everybody

If there is no shame, then WHO GIVES A FUCK. There will be no hiding anything, and would be fair on every side of the story.

ALLOW there to be a 'report' button

This would display a complaint you have filed with Rep you have received, and a mod could then look into it.

Nothin else needs to be changed.

[talentedhamster]

Good idea. and all reps coming from anyone with like, less than 2 bars shouldnt count

[!King_Amazon!]

I was actually suggesting D3v's idea yesterday.

If all rep is made public, people can't abuse it since everyone will know anyway.

However, rep does nothing currently. It serves no purpose. Until it can actually do something, you might as well can it.

Someone had suggested to make it where if you're at a higher level of rep you get a discount in a shop, but as we have no shop, that doesn't help right now.

[Asamin]

How about you can get a free lesson on how to do sigs like GLG and Sov.

[Adrenachrome]

No neg rep + require comments to add rep

[talentedhamster]

its just fun and games for now. grow up and just hve fun with it.

[Asamin]

It is all just fun and games till someone gets negative rep....

[-Spector-]

Wheres the "Make all rep. public" option?

[Asamin]

Somewhere special that you don't know about.

I don't think it has been made yet.

[KagomJack]

I can see who reps me.

Also, don't take away neg rep. It just shows that some people are taking this too seriously.

[Asamin]

How can you tell if anyone reps you? I don't think they rep me tho. Makes me sad.

[KagomJack]

I don't know WHEN I'm repped, but if I look at my User CP I can see who has and all that jazz.

[Thanatos]

However, rep does nothing currently. It serves no purpose. Until it can actually do something, you might as well can it.

Why? This is an added incentive to keep people coming back and to attract new members. Maybe it's not going to make that much of a difference, but at least it's something?

[D3V]

x2.

Totally agree.

[!King_Amazon!]

Why? This is an added incentive to keep people coming back and to attract new members. Maybe it's not going to make that much of a difference, but at least it's something?
How is it an incentive to come back? It doesn't do anything. It serves no purpose other than e-peen enlargement.

Of course, the same could be said about post count, but my post count is not determined by what some retard thinks of me.

[talentedhamster]

just let it be

[Adrenachrome]

How is it an incentive to come back? It doesn't do anything. It serves no purpose other than e-peen enlargement.

Of course, the same could be said about post count, but my post count is not determined by what some retard thinks of me.


If there were more people to look up to, more people that posted thought provoking dialogue, rather than accusations and intimidations people would be more likely to want to get their two cents in. This is why discussions outside of the chatterbox and flame forum should be held to the rules and emptied of a good portion of the post disencouraging content.

I could not tell you how many times I have read an interesting opening post and by the time I filtered through all the spam, shit talk and other bullshit, I didn't care to add my thoughts to such intellectually devoid conversations.

[!King_Amazon!]

If there were more people to look up to, more people that posted thought provoking dialogue, rather than accusations and intimidations people would be more likely to want to get their two cents in. This is why discussions outside of the chatterbox and flame forum should be held to the rules and emptied of a good portion of the post disencouraging content.

I could not tell you how many times I have read an interesting opening post and by the time I filtered through all the spam, shit talk and other bullshit, I didn't care to add my thoughts to such intellectually devoid conversations.
I agree. And if we had a shop where Rep was factored in, and people actually CARED about whether or not they've got good rep, you could effectively use it to keep people in line.

Right now, though, anyone with half a brain shouldn't give a shit whether they get negative or positive rep, because it doesn't do anything to them.

[Adrenachrome]

Well the way I see it. It doesn't do anything to them because of the immature way some people use it. Being that I want it to be useful I refuse to abuse it.


... If only everyone wanted it to help.

[!King_Amazon!]

Making all rep public and having it be somewhat moderated would help that. I still think it needs to have some sort of reward and punishment, though. Really, if it doesn't, it's just a number. You guys could negatively rep me all you want right now and I really wouldn't care.

[Adrenachrome]

The reward is positive rep, the punishment is negative rep.

[!King_Amazon!]

But neither of them do anything. That's my point. It's not a very effective reward/punishment if it doesn't do anything. If having higher rep did something for you, people would care more about getting good rep. Currently, it does nothing, so I honestly couldn't care less.

[WetWired]

People cared about activity when it did nothing. People care about post count when it does nothing. Why wouldn't they care about rep when it does nothing?

[Thanatos]

Good point, WW.

[D3V]

People cared about activity when it did nothing. People care about post count when it does nothing. Why wouldn't they care about rep when it does nothing?


Why even bother, let people care about shit. It keeps people around the forums, because we all know the discussions aren't keeping members around.

[!King_Amazon!]

People cared about activity when it did nothing. People care about post count when it does nothing. Why wouldn't they care about rep when it does nothing?
Of course, the same could be said about post count, but my post count is not determined by what some retard thinks of me.

Same applies to activity.

[Asamin]

I never cared about my post count or rep. Only activity cuz i want to keep this avatar.

[Adrenachrome]

But neither of them do anything. That's my point. It's not a very effective reward/punishment if it doesn't do anything. If having higher rep did something for you, people would care more about getting good rep. Currently, it does nothing, so I honestly couldn't care less.


Uhh.. You are looking right past my point.

Positive rep makes you look credible, negative rep makes you look like a dick.

Do you wish to look credible or like a dick?

[Grav]

I can think of a few forums where people collect neg rep to be badass or whatever.

[Adrenachrome]

Well that's fine too. I am just having a hard time figuring out exactly what KA wants the reputation to "do" for us members. IMO it does just what it is suposed to do, represent the opinion of members about another member. Nevermind rewards, the reward is the positive, or negative rep in itself

[!King_Amazon!]

Uhh.. You are looking right past my point.

Positive rep makes you look credible, negative rep makes you look like a dick.

Do you wish to look credible or like a dick?
Without rep moderation, that is just simply untrue. For instance, D3v was the first person to reach 3 bars. By cheating. That doesn't make him look credible at all.

If rep were made public, and were moderated, it WOULD serve a bit of a purpose, even without having incentives for having higher rep. Either way, if someone doesn't give a shit about their rep, then negatively repping them won't matter.

This is my point. If it's tied into a shop system of sorts, you essentially MAKE people want positive rep, and encourage people to not be asshats, so they don't get negative rep.

[Asamin]

Why are we still discussing this? WW will do something about it when he has time! Just stop talking about it!

[WetWired]

Actually, the majority opinion seems to be that there's nothing wrong with it, so I have to plans to change it.

To be honest, for me to invest a lot of time in something outside of work, it has to be "fun", or "new and interesting." AJAX chatbox is "new and interesting." AJAX games are "new and interesting." Moderation systems are "old and boring." I will, however, try to convince myself that migrating to vB 3.7 is "new and interesting." Somehow...

[!King_Amazon!]

Actually, the majority opinion seems to be that there's nothing wrong with it, so I have to plans to change it.

To be honest, for me to invest a lot of time in something outside of work, it has to be "fun", or "new and interesting." AJAX chatbox is "new and interesting." AJAX games are "new and interesting." Moderation systems are "old and boring." I will, however, try to convince myself that migrating to vB 3.7 is "new and interesting." Somehow...
Can't you at least make all rep public?

[WetWired]

Not that I know. The reputation settings are currently at their most permissive, with the exception that rep hiding is off.

[Asamin]

You wrote the code for this site. Why can't you just change it?

[WetWired]

No, the vast majority of the code was written by Jelsoft. Reputation is a feature that comes standard.

[Asamin]

And you are sure that there is no way to change it?

Who is Jelsoft?

[WetWired]

It can be changed, but it's not simple, and I'm not familiar with that code. Jelsoft is the developer of vB.

[D3V]

I really think Rep is fine. And people should not be allowed to disable it, that would eliminate the whole purpose of this site running with e-rep.

[Thanatos]

Another poll that was tampered with?

[D3V]

Yes I'm assuming so as well, that's the first thing I noticed that the 11 think that. What a crock of shit, We can't even trust the mods around here to be legitimate, that or guests are "posting" these, which could just be some of our actual members logged out, which would probably be the case.

[Lenny]

We can't even trust the mods around here to be legitimate

I'm sorry, run that by me again...

Mods cannot edit polls. Mods have not been able to edit polls for a very long time. It has been brought up before now that mods cannot edit polls.

Admins can, but admins are a different story altogether.

[D3V]

I thought they could skew the results.

[Lenny]

Nope. We can't even add a poll to a thread without making a new one and then merging the two.

I can't remember the reason WW gave for taking the ability to edit polls aay from Mods, but he did.

[D3V]

Oh I see, I guess I was misinformed, or misread. But what about guests voting? Wouldn't that skew the results, and can you see who voted for what? ..

[Lenny]

WW fixed the problem of guests voting yesterday, I believe. He deleted their votes from Grav's shower poll, and will probably get round to deleting them from this one, if indeed guests have skewed the results.

[Thanatos]

Last I saw there were 3 people that voted "Yes, let people disable it for themselves" - now there's 8 more people that voted for that option in 1 day? Find it hard to believe...

[D3V]

That's how I see it, and this being a somewhat sensitive subject for some, atleast make the polls represent what everyone thinks, not what one douchebag wants to persuade. This is like a lobbyist in action, somebody with power over others pushing what they want when in reality nobody in the public eye wants this.

[WetWired]

I knew that there were guest votes, but I didn't bother to remove them because I use the admin "who voted" for this kind of poll anyways, since that way I can filter inactive members.

[D3V]

Okay, back down to 4. That looks more reasonable, and the tally is in. Now close this thread, and start arguing on how we can make the sytem better, and implent new things into Zelaron to make the webstie as a whole better.

[Grav]

Well according to the poll, not including those who abstained, the poll is split evenly in half between those who think it is okay and those who think it should be changed.

[D3V]

Draw = it stays the same.

[Grav]

You're ignoring half of the forum either way. I'm not saying there is an easy way to solve the problem, I'm just saying it's not that clear cut.

[D3V]

It's because there are too many variables in that poll.